tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post5265643830572376884..comments2024-03-26T23:41:10.319+00:00Comments on Authors Electric: The Novel is Dead. Long Live the Novel by Dan HollowayKatherine Robertshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17196712319655603442noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-59301421034695134142012-08-16T21:02:39.410+01:002012-08-16T21:02:39.410+01:00I've liked the page Tim, thanks - funnily enou...I've liked the page Tim, thanks - funnily enough there's an article in The Millions (on Sergio De La Pava) linked to on the page that mentions Helen De WittDan Hollowayhttp://danholloway.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-64026493373440639642012-08-16T20:53:08.860+01:002012-08-16T20:53:08.860+01:00Experimental writing. Interesting!Experimental writing. Interesting!Stephanie Ziahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01574005537624406743noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-11306239593593029112012-08-16T20:26:38.358+01:002012-08-16T20:26:38.358+01:00Definitely look into this brand new Facebook commu...Definitely look into this brand new Facebook community, "Who says that serious literature is dead?":<br /><br />http://www.facebook.com/pages/Who-says-that-serious-literature-is-dead/120325654771866<br /><br />Lee, what is Helen DeWitt doing? Can you elaborate?timnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-23706364449241389872012-08-16T18:07:22.494+01:002012-08-16T18:07:22.494+01:00yes, I completely agree with that having spent mor...yes, I completely agree with that having spent more years than I care to mention in academia where people simply refuse to use one simple word when ten long ones will do - just to show how "clever" there are. There's a big difference, though, between difficult and complex - the complexity of life comes from the fact that every experience of every sensation is different and the moment we start to generalise that complexity we lose the glorious diversity of life.Dan Hollowayhttp://danholloway.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-8108961409385691332012-08-16T15:02:22.584+01:002012-08-16T15:02:22.584+01:00Talk about fortuitous stumbling! Here's Frank ...Talk about fortuitous stumbling! Here's Frank WIlson's (booksinq) thought for the day:<br /><br />'An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way.'<br /><br />— Charles Bukowski<br /><br />;-)Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13770069472552779217noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-27785608431812056662012-08-16T14:39:28.646+01:002012-08-16T14:39:28.646+01:00People write & read novels for all sorts of re...People write & read novels for all sorts of reasons, but a simplicity of form doesn't necessarily shortcircuit thinking. If anything, it's probably extremely difficult to express complexity in a simple manner, but that's one of the reasons why archetypes (and to quote McKee, not stereotypes) work so well - and have done for thousands of years.<br /><br />To put it another way: something that is chaotic doesn't necessarily capture complexity and chaos - at leas not effectively.Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13770069472552779217noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-48791491589182458842012-08-16T14:31:56.871+01:002012-08-16T14:31:56.871+01:00yes, that's exactly why I think people write a...yes, that's exactly why I think people write and read novels - because they give an appearance of simplicity and order to something that is complex and chaotic. We look for things that short circuit thinking about reality too hard because if we do it can be very troublingDan Hollowayhttp://danholloway.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-60101181323043289722012-08-16T11:01:13.859+01:002012-08-16T11:01:13.859+01:00Dan, Dan, Dan, as you know I'm stood both feet...Dan, Dan, Dan, as you know I'm stood both feet squarely in your camp, BUT...<br /><br />The trad, careworn novel form is getting a huge adrenalin injection through self-publishing as new writers faithfully cling to the moribund beginning, middle, en narrative, charcater arc and redemption.<br /><br />I am fascinated why so many people come to writing and choose to express themselves through writing a novel. Why does someone want to write a detective story and spin us a yarn we'vbe probably heard/read hundreds of times before? <br /><br />I can only think it is to do with their identity. That because their life is not all neatly joined up and linear, they assert some control by producing a fictional narrative in which a life is joined up and linear. It's probably related to why grown ups read Harry Potter, why people see an Olympic cyclist gold medal winner and then go out and buy a £1000 bike, why half the women in this country bhave opted for an off-the bpeg mass produced erotic fantasy by numbers read in the 50 Shades phenomena. <br /><br />The novel isn't dead. It's without life, but it is cryogenically twitching believing it is respiring...Sulci Collectivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03293833259808943096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-25228850686465496462012-08-16T10:43:18.756+01:002012-08-16T10:43:18.756+01:00Ah, that'd be because I don't have a Guard...Ah, that'd be because I don't have a Guardian column :)<br /><br />Beginnings, middles and ends in the wrong places sounds very cool - proper Modernist cut-up. It's interesting thinking about how we think about our lives in the light of that - how do we experience our autobiography? It's not just that we don't remember a clear and continuous line, it's that for every point on that line the way we remember it is tinted by every other pointDan Hollowayhttp://danholloway.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-57664120285999167272012-08-16T10:33:00.223+01:002012-08-16T10:33:00.223+01:00Dan. I am asking myself why YOU are not one of the...Dan. I am asking myself why YOU are not one of the 'acclaimed 50 writers' tasked with debating this very question on Tuesday 21st at the World Writers Conference. I'm going to put my money where my mouth is and say that I predict that what you've written here will kick ass over whatever they end up concluding! <br /><br />As for<br />But I genuinely believe that it is impossible for a serious reflective artist to write a story with a beginning, a middle and an end.<br /><br />For many years (in plays as well)I 've played around with having beginnings, middles and endings but NOT in the usual places. CHASING WAVES clips at the ebookfestival site explore this. My 1999 play Love is an Urban Myth is ALL about this and the trilogy I'm currently 'wrestling' with is also about this too. <br />I am going to read and re-read what you've written and think and think about it. Thank you. I like it when someone sticks their head up and has something significant to say! All this AND I get to see HUNGERFORD BRIDGE tonight at 9pm. <br />Thanks Dan. Ceud mille (1000 times) CallyPhillipshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15481379296340077102noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-88919194732091127472012-08-16T10:30:37.219+01:002012-08-16T10:30:37.219+01:00thanks, Lee - very interesting - here's the re...thanks, Lee - very interesting - here's the reference to her blog for people who are interested http://www.paperpools.blogspot.co.uk/Dan Hollowayhttp://danholloway.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-58189939377159209152012-08-16T10:26:52.279+01:002012-08-16T10:26:52.279+01:00Yes, I think you're probably right. I oscillat...Yes, I think you're probably right. I oscillate between optimistically saying wrestle with the novel and realistically saying wrestle with the written form but I think you're right that it's a back to the drawing board approach needed - I do think it's important to understand why we're turning our back on the novel though - what exactly it is that makes it inappropriate so that we can avoid those problemsDan Hollowayhttp://danholloway.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-76320169206269933102012-08-16T10:23:51.085+01:002012-08-16T10:23:51.085+01:00Dan, have a look at what Helen de Witt is doing wi...Dan, have a look at what Helen de Witt is doing with information design and statistics.Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13770069472552779217noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-37575039593676841692012-08-16T10:08:14.351+01:002012-08-16T10:08:14.351+01:00I agree, Dan, we must wrestle with form. But does ...I agree, Dan, we must wrestle with form. But does that mean we have to wrestle with the novel? To me that's a bit like wrestling with the sonnet or the haiku - push it too far and it becomes something different. <br /><br />To challenge the form of the novel without disappointing the reader is hard - and sometimes even if you achieve it, it feels like a trick.<br /><br />Sometimes I think it is necessary to just let go of the novel form, which is still essentially a 19th century form, and use words in another way. Roland Denningnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-19622011689346877462012-08-16T09:36:59.127+01:002012-08-16T09:36:59.127+01:00Lee, I think that's absolutely right - but as ...Lee, I think that's absolutely right - but as writers I think one of the most important things is to push things beyond satisfying (depending what we're trying to do with our writing of course)<br /><br />Pauline - yes, language is certainly part of what makes us human - it is what we use to make sense of our experiences - but as such it is removing us from them in order to make sense and we are locked into the idea both that we have to make sense of the world and that language is the only way to do it. So one very important thing the writer can do is question whether these assumptions are right/necessary. Of course, there are further problems because numbers are a language just like any other (as Russell shows when he uses logic to unify mathematics and syntax). I think a novel written in numbers is also a key way of describing life in the digital ageDan Hollowayhttp://danholloway.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-75603622451069174852012-08-16T09:17:45.410+01:002012-08-16T09:17:45.410+01:00Oh, Dan. Enjoyed reading everything you had to say...Oh, Dan. Enjoyed reading everything you had to say, not least as the question of what identity does or doesn’t mean in a world that has no metanarrative is one that interests me too. But numbers? You failed - in words - to convey that one to me! Disunction doesn't do it justice. Words are part of what makes us human. I chill at the thought of any writer giving up on them. Pauline Fiskhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11826696982301252524noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2429560125838989988.post-69517720174876003972012-08-16T06:59:55.352+01:002012-08-16T06:59:55.352+01:00One could just as easily argue that life's com...One could just as easily argue that life's complexity is what makes the conventional narrative arc so satisfying. Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13770069472552779217noreply@blogger.com